Feasibility of a bootable linux cdrom with a game in SDL

Hello,

I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux cdrom
that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

In this way, users would not have to install anything on their system:
they could just boot from the CD without being aware that Linux is used.

The first problem I foresee is the setup of the video and
audio systems (because I would like the CD to function on most PCs).

Searching on the web for “Linux bootable cdrom game”
system", I found a text written by YAMAMORI Takenori, but he did
not solve the auto hardware configuration problem.

Hardware autodetection seem to have improved a lot in the latest linux
distrbutions (e.g. Mandrake 9), but did it reach the point where we
could start Xwindow (in 1024x768 and 24bit depth) and have the alsa sound
system ready to play?

I would like to know what people on this list think about this.
For example, should we use the framebuffer rather the XWindow?

Christophe Pallier

Hello!

I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable
Linux cdrom that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

There already are bootable linuxes like this one:
http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/

The first problem I foresee is the setup of the video and
audio systems (because I would like the CD to function on most PCs).

Knoppix has a very good automatic hardware detection,
so you probably should have a look at it!

Ciao,
eike

Hello,

I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux cdrom
that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

I must first say that I think that developing this capability would be a
huge service to the Linux game development community. Go for it.

Look at KNOPPIX. http://www.knoppix.org/ It does pretty much what you
want it to do. Boots from a CD and configures a workable system.

In this way, users would not have to install anything on their system:
they could just boot from the CD without being aware that Linux is used.

The first problem I foresee is the setup of the video and
audio systems (because I would like the CD to function on most PCs).

I recently built a new computer for my wife, I installed RedHat 8.0 and
it configured the CD and the video just fine. I had to run a second
application that came with RH to configure the sound. But, it worked
perfectly the first time.

I believe that what you want to do is doable. It may be hard, but it is
NOT impossible.

Searching on the web for “Linux bootable cdrom game"
system”, I found a text written by YAMAMORI Takenori, but he did
not solve the auto hardware configuration problem.

Hardware autodetection seem to have improved a lot in the latest linux
distrbutions (e.g. Mandrake 9), but did it reach the point where we
could start Xwindow (in 1024x768 and 24bit depth) and have the alsa sound
system ready to play?

I would like to know what people on this list think about this.
For example, should we use the framebuffer rather the XWindow?

I think there are more drivers for X than for straight framebuffer
support, but I could very well wrong. Using X will make it easier to use
the graphic card for acceleration.

	Bob PendletonOn Wed, 2003-01-22 at 02:44, Pallier Christophe wrote:

Christophe Pallier
www.pallier.org


SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

±-----------------------------------+

I’ve recently made a bootable Linux CD to play Arcade games
called AdvanceCD.

You can fount it at http://advancemame.sourceforge.net

It uses SVGALIB for video and ALSA for sound, both supported by SDL.
You need only to add a custom SDL using these libraries.

Both SVGALIB and ALSA are able to autodetect the hardware.On 01/22, Pallier Christophe wrote:

Hello,
I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux cdrom
that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

Andrea Mazzoleni
935A 2D3C 5C70 BCD6 CB0C ED89 7C19 4321 6340 3F6D

A few years ago, a Linux magazine in Japan did this, using one of my
SDL-based games as an example:

http://www15.big.or.jp/~yamamori/sun/tech-linux-2/index_e.html

-bill!On Wed, Jan 22, 2003 at 08:07:24AM -0600, Bob Pendleton wrote:

On Wed, 2003-01-22 at 02:44, Pallier Christophe wrote:

Hello,

I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux cdrom
that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

I must first say that I think that developing this capability would be a
huge service to the Linux game development community. Go for it.

hmm…do you guys think people would be very willing to reboot their
computer to play your game? lots of people like chatting on aim, listening
to mp3s etc while playing games and that would make it impossible. I dont
really see the reason for this unless you just wanted to code the game on
linux…but sdl is multiplatform so whats the problem with recompiling for
other OS’s?

Just some thoughts
-Atrix> ----- Original Message -----

From: nbs@sonic.net (Bill Kendrick)
To:
Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2003 9:57 AM
Subject: Re: [SDL] feasibility of a bootable linux cdrom with a game in SDL

On Wed, Jan 22, 2003 at 08:07:24AM -0600, Bob Pendleton wrote:

On Wed, 2003-01-22 at 02:44, Pallier Christophe wrote:

Hello,

I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux
cdrom

that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

I must first say that I think that developing this capability would be a
huge service to the Linux game development community. Go for it.

A few years ago, a Linux magazine in Japan did this, using one of my
SDL-based games as an example:

http://www15.big.or.jp/~yamamori/sun/tech-linux-2/index_e.html

-bill!


SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

Gentoo (www.genoo.org) created a live CD with unreal 2k3 demo on it. It works
great with every set of video/audio cards I’ve tried.

/Line72On Wednesday 22 January 2003 11:36, Andrea Mazzoleni wrote:

On 01/22, Pallier Christophe wrote:

Hello,
I am wondering about the feasability of creating a bootable Linux cdrom
that would launch directly a program written in SDL.

I’ve recently made a bootable Linux CD to play Arcade games
called AdvanceCD.

You can fount it at http://advancemame.sourceforge.net

It uses SVGALIB for video and ALSA for sound, both supported by SDL.
You need only to add a custom SDL using these libraries.

Both SVGALIB and ALSA are able to autodetect the hardware.


17:06:32 up 1 day, 5 min, 2 users, load average: 0.89, 0.70, 0.36

hmm…do you guys think people would be very willing to reboot their
computer to play your game? lots of people like chatting on
aim, listening to mp3s etc while playing games and that would make it
impossible.

Depends on the type of game.
You wouldn’t want to chat while playing a Quake-like game. :wink:

Ciao,
Eike

hmm…do you guys think people would be very willing to reboot their
computer to play your game? lots of people like chatting on
aim, listening to mp3s etc while playing games and that
would make it impossible.

PS: As I’m playing on windows and doing everything else with linux,
I do reboot for playing games. But I don’t know if “people” will like
it, too. :o)
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While Microsoft is busy turning consoles into PC’s, Pallier Christophe is
equally busy turning PC’s into consoles. :slight_smile:

My experience with Knoppix CDs is that pretty well everybody you show the
disk to wants to put it in their PC and boot it. Anyway, as I recall from my
Windows years, rebooting gets to be a perfectly normal thing, something like
adjusting the brightness control.

The big feature of Knoppix is that, once you’re running on the CD, you can
make the install “real”, effortlessly, after you already know everything’s
working. This goes a long way towards reducing stress and uncertainty.
There’s no reason to restrict this idea to the base OS: once you’re already
running the game and want it permanently on your system, wave your hands and
make it so. Even bring the game state across so you can boot back to your
native OS and continue where you were. With a little extra effort,
installing to Windows could be supported as well as to Linux.

I think this is an extremely worthwhile project, and as a few people said
earlier, do take a look at Knoppix; tracking that project will save a whole
lot of effort.

Regards,

DanielOn Thursday 23 January 2003 17:07, Eike Sauer wrote:

hmm…do you guys think people would be very willing to reboot their
computer to play your game? lots of people like chatting on
aim, listening to mp3s etc while playing games and that
would make it impossible.

PS: As I’m playing on windows and doing everything else with linux,
I do reboot for playing games. But I don’t know if “people” will like
it, too. :o)

I think this is an extremely worthwhile project, and as a few people
said earlier, do take a look at Knoppix; tracking that project will
save a whole lot of effort.

Except the fact that it is GPL and thus you have to release the modified
cd image. So it makes things harder if you are doing commercial
product, because you have to let anybody get that image without any
fees except the possible media and shipping costs.On Thursday 23 January 2003 19:22, Daniel Phillips wrote:

I think this is an extremely worthwhile project, and as a few people
said earlier, do take a look at Knoppix; tracking that project will
save a whole lot of effort.

Except the fact that it is GPL and thus you have to release the modified
cd image. So it makes things harder if you are doing commercial
product, because you have to let anybody get that image without any
fees except the possible media and shipping costs.

Note that the GPL only requires you to make the changes available to
whoever has your software. For example, you could require that the
customers present a CD key and ship them the sources to the modified
image if they request it.

See ya,
-Sam Lantinga, Software Engineer, Blizzard Entertainment> On Thursday 23 January 2003 19:22, Daniel Phillips wrote:

Note that the GPL only requires you to make the changes available to
whoever has your software. For example, you could require that the
customers present a CD key and ship them the sources to the modified
image if they request it.

Of course, for obvious reasons it’s always nice to send your changes
back to the authors. :slight_smile:

I’m going to skip a step and ask that people stop this thread now. :slight_smile:

See ya!
-Sam Lantinga, Software Engineer, Blizzard Entertainment

Sayeth Sam Lantinga on Thu, Jan 23, 2003 at 07:09:38PM -0800:

[self-inflicted GPL debate starter removed]

I’m going to skip a step and ask that people stop this thread now. :slight_smile:

LOL!!!

Thx,
-daniel
@Daniel_Hedrick
There are 10 types of people in this world…
those who understand binary, and those who don’t.

I don’t think such a limited written offer would satisfy the 3b option
in the GPL. If anyone’s thinking about doing this, at least ask the
FSF for their opinion first.

(I’m not looking to start a legal debate on this list; just making sure
people aren’t taking legal advice from it. :)On Thu, Jan 23, 2003 at 07:04:23PM -0800, Sam Lantinga wrote:

Note that the GPL only requires you to make the changes available to
whoever has your software. For example, you could require that the
customers present a CD key and ship them the sources to the modified
image if they request it.


Glenn Maynard

I think this is an extremely worthwhile project, and as a few people
said earlier, do take a look at Knoppix; tracking that project will
save a whole lot of effort.

Except the fact that it is GPL and thus you have to release the modified
cd image. So it makes things harder if you are doing commercial
product, because you have to let anybody get that image without any
fees except the possible media and shipping costs.

Some of us consider that to be a good thing, not a problem. Even though
the Linux distribution would have to be released, you are NOT forced to
release the source of your game or any of the sounds, images, and so on
that make up the game. The result would be that you have a nice way to
release your games, and so do the rest of us.

	Bob PendletonOn Thu, 2003-01-23 at 12:58, Sami N??t?nen wrote:

On Thursday 23 January 2003 19:22, Daniel Phillips wrote:


SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

±-----------------------------------+

True. A bootable CD with a full Linux on it, plus a collection of game demos
would be a cinch to get glued onto the cover of every hardcore gamer magazine
out there, not to mention a few general computer rags.

Regards,

DanielOn Friday 24 January 2003 04:40, Bob Pendleton wrote:

…The result would be that you have a nice way to release your games, and
so do the rest of us.

Hello!

Except the fact that it is GPL and thus you have to release
the modified cd image.

As far as I understand from http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/#license,
the sources are under GPL, not the whole image. So you’ll just have
to make public what you changed, not the sources of your added programs.

Ciao,
Eike

Yep my miss read. The software on the cd is GPL (well atleast most of
it) not the cd image itself so the added software does NOt fall under
GPL.On Friday 24 January 2003 14:42, Eike Sauer wrote:

Hello!

Except the fact that it is GPL and thus you have to release
the modified cd image.

As far as I understand from http://www.knopper.net/knoppix/#license,
the sources are under GPL, not the whole image. So you’ll just have
to make public what you changed, not the sources of your added
programs.