Newsgroups: loki.open-source.sdl
Yeah there are such great articles !!! Actually I’v heard about SDL with
those articles… but I still keep in mind that in a few months I wish Sam
should release a book about SDL !I have constantly thought about going to O’Reilly and asking if they’d be
interested in having a book about Linux Game Programming up on their
shelves. That’d be cool. We could get somebody nifty, like Dave "Zoid"
Kirsch, Scott Draeker, or even our very own Sam Lantinga, to write the
foreword.Does anybody else think this is a good idea? If so, would they buy it? It
would PROBABLY cover (it roughly this order, and understand that this
would be pretty damn comprehensive!)PART ONE: TWO DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
– Basic primer on programming under Linux – IDEs, what these Makefiles
are, etc.
– Introduction to using SDL and SDL surfaces
– GDB
– principles of two dimensional gaming, focusing largely on tile engines
– just for a change, there’d be some stuff on writing an RPG
– input handling with SDL
– image loading with SDL_Image
– event coordinationPART TWO: THREE DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
The entire chapter would be presented with the aim of writing a simple
Quake-like engine.– OpenGL and SDL integration
– Mesa, Utah-GLX, and other key products
– About seven chapters worth of OpenGL programming information. This would
be highly cut down from the formal SGI guides because you don’t need to know
about 80% of the extra crap that they include in there. Also included in
these seven chapters would be:
– the Multitexture_ARB extension
– lightmapping
– the Compiled Vertex Arrays extension
– how to optimize for Mesa (where are the strong points? where are the
weak points? where will it just plain not work?)PART THREE: THINGS TO TRY, LIBRARIES TO USE
these things really all do deserve their own books, but they are essential
tools that I use quite a bit, so primers are VERY good things to have.– Use of the sockets library
– SDL and CDROM code
– Sound with SDL_Mixer
– NASM
– integrating scripting with Guile
– Working with GTK+
– Richard Stallman’s Bastard Offspring: autoconf and automakePART FOUR: PORTING SOFTWARE (or: correcting the big mistake)
– Porting two dimensional games from Windows to Linux and SDL
– Porting OpenGL code from Windows to Linux (short chapter! :-))
– Making Direct3D code work with Linux and OpenGL. (and it ain’t pretty…
right, Michael? :-))
– Making Macintosh Toolbox/Quickdraw/orwhateveritis (I don’t remember, it’s
been ages since I last dabbled in those arcane arts) games work with Linux
and SDLTotal running time: ~850 pages or so of my maniacal ranting, not including
CD-ROM with extra material. Also useful as a paperweight, for stopping
things from moving (like tanks), Would anybody actually buy this, or be
interested in co-authoring? (Approximate price, if I’m any judge of
horseflesh, would be $50.00 US)Nicholas
Nicholas Vining “While you’re out there struggling
vining at pacificcoast.net with your computer, I’m naked,
icq: 20872003 clueless, and feeling good!”
- Ratbert----- Original Message -----
From: sylvain.hellegouarch@wanadoo.fr (Sylvain Hellegouarch)
To: sdl at lokigames.com
Date: Sunday, February 27, 2000 4:44 PM
Subject: [SDL] Re: French SDL articles
Total running time: ~850 pages or so of my maniacal ranting, not including
CD-ROM with extra material. Also useful as a paperweight, for stopping
things from moving (like tanks), Would anybody actually buy this, or be
interested in co-authoring? (Approximate price, if I’m any judge of
horseflesh, would be $50.00 US)
Of course people would buy it, as long as it was well written and
informative.
Long live the confused,
Akawaka.On Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Nicholas Vining wrote:
Bother, said Pooh as ran C3PO through the trash compactor.
I would be very interested in buying it! Do it! Seriously, it’s all about
the money your gonna make anyways right? 
j/kOn Sun, 27 Feb 2000, Nicholas Vining wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: Sylvain Hellegouarch <sylvain.hellegouarch at wanadoo.fr>
Newsgroups: loki.open-source.sdl
To: sdl at lokigames.com
Date: Sunday, February 27, 2000 4:44 PM
Subject: [SDL] Re: French SDL articlesYeah there are such great articles !!! Actually I’v heard about SDL with
those articles… but I still keep in mind that in a few months I wish Sam
should release a book about SDL !I have constantly thought about going to O’Reilly and asking if they’d be
interested in having a book about Linux Game Programming up on their
shelves. That’d be cool. We could get somebody nifty, like Dave "Zoid"
Kirsch, Scott Draeker, or even our very own Sam Lantinga, to write the
foreword.Does anybody else think this is a good idea? If so, would they buy it? It
would PROBABLY cover (it roughly this order, and understand that this
would be pretty damn comprehensive!)PART ONE: TWO DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
– Basic primer on programming under Linux – IDEs, what these Makefiles
are, etc.
– Introduction to using SDL and SDL surfaces
– GDB
– principles of two dimensional gaming, focusing largely on tile engines
– just for a change, there’d be some stuff on writing an RPG
– input handling with SDL
– image loading with SDL_Image
– event coordinationPART TWO: THREE DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
The entire chapter would be presented with the aim of writing a simple
Quake-like engine.– OpenGL and SDL integration
– Mesa, Utah-GLX, and other key products
– About seven chapters worth of OpenGL programming information. This would
be highly cut down from the formal SGI guides because you don’t need to know
about 80% of the extra crap that they include in there. Also included in
these seven chapters would be:
– the Multitexture_ARB extension
– lightmapping
– the Compiled Vertex Arrays extension
– how to optimize for Mesa (where are the strong points? where are the
weak points? where will it just plain not work?)PART THREE: THINGS TO TRY, LIBRARIES TO USE
these things really all do deserve their own books, but they are essential
tools that I use quite a bit, so primers are VERY good things to have.– Use of the sockets library
– SDL and CDROM code
– Sound with SDL_Mixer
– NASM
– integrating scripting with Guile
– Working with GTK+
– Richard Stallman’s Bastard Offspring: autoconf and automakePART FOUR: PORTING SOFTWARE (or: correcting the big mistake)
– Porting two dimensional games from Windows to Linux and SDL
– Porting OpenGL code from Windows to Linux (short chapter! :-))
– Making Direct3D code work with Linux and OpenGL. (and it ain’t pretty…
right, Michael? :-))
– Making Macintosh Toolbox/Quickdraw/orwhateveritis (I don’t remember, it’s
been ages since I last dabbled in those arcane arts) games work with Linux
and SDLTotal running time: ~850 pages or so of my maniacal ranting, not including
CD-ROM with extra material. Also useful as a paperweight, for stopping
things from moving (like tanks), Would anybody actually buy this, or be
interested in co-authoring? (Approximate price, if I’m any judge of
horseflesh, would be $50.00 US)Nicholas
Nicholas Vining “While you’re out there struggling
vining at pacificcoast.net with your computer, I’m naked,
icq: 20872003 clueless, and feeling good!”
- Ratbert
I’d buy it… Will it cover character animation in 3D??>From: “Nicholas Vining”
Reply-To: sdl at lokigames.com
To:
Subject: Linux Game Programming Book (was: Re: [SDL] Re: French SDL
articles)
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 21:10:03 -0800-----Original Message-----
From: Sylvain Hellegouarch <sylvain.hellegouarch at wanadoo.fr>
Newsgroups: loki.open-source.sdl
To: sdl at lokigames.com
Date: Sunday, February 27, 2000 4:44 PM
Subject: [SDL] Re: French SDL articlesYeah there are such great articles !!! Actually I’v heard about SDL with
those articles… but I still keep in mind that in a few months I wish
Sam
should release a book about SDL !I have constantly thought about going to O’Reilly and asking if they’d be
interested in having a book about Linux Game Programming up on their
shelves. That’d be cool. We could get somebody nifty, like Dave "Zoid"
Kirsch, Scott Draeker, or even our very own Sam Lantinga, to write the
foreword.Does anybody else think this is a good idea? If so, would they buy it? It
would PROBABLY cover (it roughly this order, and understand that this
would be pretty damn comprehensive!)PART ONE: TWO DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
– Basic primer on programming under Linux – IDEs, what these Makefiles
are, etc.
– Introduction to using SDL and SDL surfaces
– GDB
– principles of two dimensional gaming, focusing largely on tile engines
– just for a change, there’d be some stuff on writing an RPG
– input handling with SDL
– image loading with SDL_Image
– event coordinationPART TWO: THREE DIMENSIONAL GRAPHICS
The entire chapter would be presented with the aim of writing a simple
Quake-like engine.– OpenGL and SDL integration
– Mesa, Utah-GLX, and other key products
– About seven chapters worth of OpenGL programming information. This would
be highly cut down from the formal SGI guides because you don’t need to
know
about 80% of the extra crap that they include in there. Also included in
these seven chapters would be:
– the Multitexture_ARB extension
– lightmapping
– the Compiled Vertex Arrays extension
– how to optimize for Mesa (where are the strong points? where are
the
weak points? where will it just plain not work?)PART THREE: THINGS TO TRY, LIBRARIES TO USE
these things really all do deserve their own books, but they are essential
tools that I use quite a bit, so primers are VERY good things to have.– Use of the sockets library
– SDL and CDROM code
– Sound with SDL_Mixer
– NASM
– integrating scripting with Guile
– Working with GTK+
– Richard Stallman’s Bastard Offspring: autoconf and automakePART FOUR: PORTING SOFTWARE (or: correcting the big mistake)
– Porting two dimensional games from Windows to Linux and SDL
– Porting OpenGL code from Windows to Linux (short chapter! :-))
– Making Direct3D code work with Linux and OpenGL. (and it ain’t pretty…
right, Michael? :-))
– Making Macintosh Toolbox/Quickdraw/orwhateveritis (I don’t remember,
it’s
been ages since I last dabbled in those arcane arts) games work with Linux
and SDLTotal running time: ~850 pages or so of my maniacal ranting, not including
CD-ROM with extra material. Also useful as a paperweight, for stopping
things from moving (like tanks), Would anybody actually buy this, or be
interested in co-authoring? (Approximate price, if I’m any judge of
horseflesh, would be $50.00 US)Nicholas
Nicholas Vining “While you’re out there struggling
vining at pacificcoast.net with your computer, I’m naked,
icq: 20872003 clueless, and feeling good!”
- Ratbert
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
articles)
I’d buy it… Will it cover character animation in 3D??
Now THAT’s a topic and a half. Some of the mathematics behind it (bone
structure based animation) is complex, and probably deserves a chapter to
itself (splines are always good tools to have available). This does bring up
a few questions:
- Where would people want the focus to be more on? 3D? 2D? Porting code?
- How much math can you stomach?
Nicholas
Nicholas Vining “While you’re out there struggling
vining at pacificcoast.net with your computer, I’m naked,
icq: 20872003 clueless, and feeling good!”
- Ratbert----- Original Message -----
From: game_dev@hotmail.com (Uriah Liggett)
To: sdl at lokigames.com
Date: Monday, February 28, 2000 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: Linux Game Programming Book (was: Re: [SDL] Re: French SDL
- Where would people want the focus to be more on? 3D? 2D? Porting code?
Personally, 2D.
- How much math can you stomach?
Not that much. THere are books out there on OpenGL, etc. I say focus on
SDL and some of the useful libraries (including the OpenGL one), but don’t
go crazy explaining how to make Quake IV.
-bill!
- Where would people want the focus to be more on? 3D? 2D? Porting code?
I would like to have a book that focuses on “programming with sdl under
linux” (I belive most people here develop on linux ?). There are already a
lot of books on general graphics-programming, and enough real good ones too.
So portability would be most interesting as would be stuff regarding egcs,
IDEs, gdb, mesa etc.
- How much math can you stomach?
As much as it takes 
But if I would want to read about “optimal real-time
tesselation of 5-dimensional voxel-nurbs (includes proof)” then I would not
buy a book about SDL
All the best,
rob
PS: folks, you don’t need to quote 100 lines for a “me too”-mail :)On Mon, Feb 28, 2000 at 01:18:49PM -0800, Nicholas Vining wrote:
Phoenix Kokido wrote:
Maybe a few books in a set would be better than one massive tome.
Seperated out to a 2D book that mentions that 3D is done with OpenGL
but does’nt actually touch it, and a 3D book mainly about OpenGL, but
mentions that it uses SDL. I personally feel that the first few
chapters should be setting up SDL with your particular OS (Linux,
Win32, BeOS, Mac, etc) and the rest just cover techniques that work
over every OS. A benefit to doing it that way is then it is’nt just a
Linux Game Programming Book, but Game Programming Techniques with SDL.
Well that’s how I was gonna do it anyway…
Well, it would probably be best, to start with one book and tackle the
"set" as soon as the first volume is finished. Writing books is tough
and a lot of work (and I thought, programming was!).
Some month ago I started to write a tutorial to using SDL. It may
provide a good starting point for the Linux game programming book we
envisage. Its far from being finished, but a few chapters are at least
partly written. I didn’t work on it since december, so it may be a bit
messy here and there.
I recently investigated Docbook and it seems to be much for suitable for
writing technical documents of this type; I haven’t come round to
converting the Texinfo source, so you’ll have to live with this too…
Have fun
Daniel
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I had been thinking about starting an “SDL docs” site with tutorials,
example code, etc. I also saw Docbook as a good tool for documentation,
as I’m using it for a different project and the fact that it is being used
in more and more environments.
MarcusOn Tue, 29 Feb 2000, Daniel Heck wrote:
Phoenix Kokido wrote:
Maybe a few books in a set would be better than one massive tome.
Seperated out to a 2D book that mentions that 3D is done with OpenGL
but does’nt actually touch it, and a 3D book mainly about OpenGL, but
mentions that it uses SDL. I personally feel that the first few
chapters should be setting up SDL with your particular OS (Linux,
Win32, BeOS, Mac, etc) and the rest just cover techniques that work
over every OS. A benefit to doing it that way is then it is’nt just a
Linux Game Programming Book, but Game Programming Techniques with SDL.
Well that’s how I was gonna do it anyway…Well, it would probably be best, to start with one book and tackle the
"set" as soon as the first volume is finished. Writing books is tough
and a lot of work (and I thought, programming was!).Some month ago I started to write a tutorial to using SDL. It may
provide a good starting point for the Linux game programming book we
envisage. Its far from being finished, but a few chapters are at least
partly written. I didn’t work on it since december, so it may be a bit
messy here and there.I recently investigated Docbook and it seems to be much for suitable for
writing technical documents of this type; I haven’t come round to
converting the Texinfo source, so you’ll have to live with this too…
Have fun
Daniel