SDL_gui revival?

Would anybody be interested in reviving SDL_gui or just making a GUI library.
I was planning on adding one for my game engine, but I was thinking it would be
more beneficial if I made it separate from the engine and integrated it the way
I integrated SDL_ttf, and mixer. I found SDL_gui which provided me with a
pretty good framework of how I could go about designing the GUI system. (the OO
method it uses, similar to MFC)

If you are actually interested in helping to start the project email me off-list.

   -James Turk

I am actually planning on doing an SDL gui-library, which also works on
SDL-OpenGL contexts. Right now I am busy doin stuff for BWInf (a german
national computer sciences competition) and with my private life, so that i
won’t have time to get to it until the middle of the next month.

James Turk wrote:>

Would anybody be interested in reviving SDL_gui or just making a GUI
library. I was planning on adding one for my game engine, but I was
thinking it would be more beneficial if I made it separate from the engine
and integrated it the way
I integrated SDL_ttf, and mixer. I found SDL_gui which provided me with a
pretty good framework of how I could go about designing the GUI system.
(the OO method it uses, similar to MFC)

If you are actually interested in helping to start the project email me
off-list.

   -James Turk


Marix eMonkey 2002

Suggestions for the SDL_Logo:
http://www.8ung.at/cyberpunxnetwork/SDL_Logo

personal webpage:
http://www.marix.madsite.de

Would anybody be interested in reviving SDL_gui or just making a GUI library.
I was planning on adding one for my game engine, but I was thinking it would be
more beneficial if I made it separate from the engine and integrated it the way
I integrated SDL_ttf, and mixer. I found SDL_gui which provided me with a
pretty good framework of how I could go about designing the GUI system. (the OO
method it uses, similar to MFC)
I would be interested in testing it and helping with docs, but just if it
is C (no C++) based.On Sat, 26 Oct 2002, James Turk wrote:


Roger D. Vargas | El sistema se apagara en 5 segundos.
ICQ: 117641572 | Salvese el que pueda!
Linux User: 180787 |

I’m planning on doing a gui for sdl, too.
But it’s way in the future.

By the way, i recieved BWinf, too. But unfortunately i have no time.

Lion Vollnhals________________________________________________________________
Keine verlorenen Lotto-Quittungen, keine vergessenen Gewinne mehr!
Beim WEB.DE Lottoservice: http://tippen2.web.de/?x=13

Roger D. Vargas wrote:

I would be interested in testing it and helping with docs, but just if it
is C (no C++) based.

I was thinking that like many GUI libraries the core would be in C but there
would be a useful wrapper in C++, although I haven’t sat down and really layed
out my entire plan for this, get in contact with me offlist like several
interested parties already have and we can arrange a discussion to decide just
what we want in the new library.

Have fun.
Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

AlexAm Samstag, 26. Oktober 2002 18:59 schrieb James Turk:

Would anybody be interested in reviving SDL_gui or just making a GUI
library. I was planning on adding one for my game engine, but I was
thinking it would be more beneficial if I made it separate from the engine
and integrated it the way I integrated SDL_ttf, and mixer. I found SDL_gui
which provided me with a pretty good framework of how I could go about
designing the GUI system. (the OO method it uses, similar to MFC)

Alexander Pipelka wrote:> Am Samstag, 26. Oktober 2002 18:59 schrieb James Turk:

Would anybody be interested in reviving SDL_gui or just making a GUI
library. I was planning on adding one for my game engine, but I was
thinking it would be more beneficial if I made it separate from the engine
and integrated it the way I integrated SDL_ttf, and mixer. I found SDL_gui
which provided me with a pretty good framework of how I could go about
designing the GUI system. (the OO method it uses, similar to MFC)

Have fun.
Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

SDL_gui seems to be neglected… I haven’t found many using it or much work done
on it recently, and my initial idea was to revive it (as I said in my post).

   -James

SDL_gui seems to be neglected… I haven’t found many using it or much work done
on it recently, and my initial idea was to revive it (as I said in my post).

   -James

FYI, I’m using it, although not lately as I’m working on other things
right now. I picked up on as I was looking for a simple UI that would
take few resources for an embedded project. I would probably be
interested on being on a devel mailing list for it, but right now I
don’t think I could offer much in development resources except for maybe
testing. I this is going to happen, I will at least look at my code to
see if there is anything that I think would be better served by the
library itself or possible improvements.

AndyOn Sun, 2002-10-27 at 12:27, James Turk wrote:

I believe that was his entire point.

(On the other hand, I don’t know of any full-fledged GUI APIs out there that
aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a C API
with C++ wrappers.)On Sun, Oct 27, 2002 at 03:27:42PM -0500, James Turk wrote:

Have fun.
Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

SDL_gui seems to be neglected… I haven’t found many using it or much work
done on it recently, and my initial idea was to revive it (as I said in my
post).


Glenn Maynard

Glenn Maynard wrote:> On Sun, Oct 27, 2002 at 03:27:42PM -0500, James Turk wrote:

Have fun.
Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

SDL_gui seems to be neglected… I haven’t found many using it or much work
done on it recently, and my initial idea was to revive it (as I said in my
post).

I believe that was his entire point.

(On the other hand, I don’t know of any full-fledged GUI APIs out there that
aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a C API
with C++ wrappers.)

There seems to be some confusion as to where I am trying to go with this.
I am not trying to reinvent the wheel but rather to fix up SDL_gui to help out
the SDL community in some small way. And SDL_gui already is a duel C/C++ API.
(I’m sorry I may not be understanding some of what has been said, but I think
someone got confused on what I was trying to do.)

(On the other hand, I don’t know of any full-fledged GUI APIs out there
that
aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a C
API
with C++ wrappers.)

why do you say that? If anything, i think OOP is the cause for making all
the mainstream GUI API’s a hell to work with. That and trying to make a GUI
into all that and a bag of chips. I think that if someone made a GUI (or
GUI API) whose main focus was simplicity and functionality, they could
really make something powerful. Think about this…remember windows 95
which ran on 486’s barely but well on early pentiums…what as far as a GUI
have we gained since then? Perhaps alpha blended menus? Some increased
resolution since graphics cards gotten better over the past couple years?
Other than that…what really have we gained in GUI functionality. Have we
gained anything that warrants needing 20 times the processing speed that we
had before? I think not, and i blame it on OOP (not all, but OOP is easily
abused) and RAD languages for abstracting the programmer away from how the
computer itself actualy works.

itd probly be difficult to make a cross platform GUI API that was simple to
use while still being highly efficient and be only a very thin layer (which
is why i love SDL in the first place), but if SDL_gui can acheive that, i
will be very impressed and it would be a good alternative to using the .net
architecture.

sorry if i ranted too far off topic :P> ----- Original Message -----

From: g_sdl@zewt.org (Glenn Maynard)
To:
Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [SDL] SDL_gui revival?

On Sun, Oct 27, 2002 at 03:27:42PM -0500, James Turk wrote:

Have fun.
Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

SDL_gui seems to be neglected… I haven’t found many using it or much
work

done on it recently, and my initial idea was to revive it (as I said in
my

post).

I believe that was his entire point.

(On the other hand, I don’t know of any full-fledged GUI APIs out there
that
aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a C
API
with C++ wrappers.)


Glenn Maynard


SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

that

aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a C
API
with C++ wrappers.)
why do you say that? If anything, i think OOP is the cause for making all
the mainstream GUI API’s a hell to work with.

Do you mean C++ OR OOP? They are two completely different things. You
can do object oriented programming in BASIC if you want to, and write
horribly nonOOB code in C++.

–>Neil-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Neil Bradley In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is not
Synthcom Systems, Inc. king - he’s a prisoner.
ICQ #29402898

yeah, im talking about OOP. C/C++ is my language of choice, but with the
OOP capabilites of C++, you get monstrosoties of abused OOP such as MFC and
things which since they make sense in the physical world programmers assume
they make sense internaly to the computer as well (CApple inherits the
CFruit class which inherits the CPlant class which inherits the CLife class
which inherits the CThing class etc…). I aint dissin C++, just poor
programming practices and methodologies and some poorly designed languages
that work only because modern computers can waste lots of cycles and still
preform at decent speeds (:

i myself like C++ for new and delete instead of malloc and free (and i do
like structures and objects on occaision) but on the other hand prefer
*printf to cout/cin and the file io of C…fopen fread fwrite fclose etc.> ----- Original Message -----

From: nb@synthcom.com (Neil Bradley)
To:
Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 2:58 PM
Subject: Re: [SDL] SDL_gui revival?

that

aren’t hell to work with, but that’s not a gap that’ll be filled by a
C

API

with C++ wrappers.)
why do you say that? If anything, i think OOP is the cause for making
all

the mainstream GUI API’s a hell to work with.

Do you mean C++ OR OOP? They are two completely different things. You
can do object oriented programming in BASIC if you want to, and write
horribly nonOOB code in C++.

–>Neil



Neil Bradley In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is not
Synthcom Systems, Inc. king - he’s a prisoner.
ICQ #29402898


SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

Neil, you make a very good point that C++ is not OOP, I personally have a good
amount of experience in OOD/OOP, and someone made an offer to me to help
layout a good OOD for a gui library, which If I approve of may become
the basis of the GUI library. It is my belief that with a small set of
well organized classes which allow game authors to easily make options menus or
in game consoles the general quality of SDL games will increase which should be
good for everybody.

Atrix, OOP is not the reason behind alpha blended menus or poor organization,
but a general lack of planning and inability to break backwards-compatibility is
a problem behind bloated or poorly organized APIs like Win32API and MFC. I am
also by no means trying to replace .net with this GUI library, but rather a more
simple GUI library to be used within SDL games. ParaGUI takes complete control
over the SDL applications it is used in, which is not my goal.

   -James

Neil, you make a very good point that C++ is not OOP

No, no, no, take this off the list. Discuss among yourselves, if you like,
but don’t talk about language features on this list.

Thanks,
-Sam Lantinga, Software Engineer, Blizzard Entertainment

Sorry Sam,
I never meant for this to turn into such a discussion on the list. I said
I wanted people to just email me off list if they were interested in helping,
shouldn’t be this controversial.

Email me off list if you want to help, I’m trying to set up a SDL_gui mailing
list right now.

Sam Lantinga wrote:>>Neil, you make a very good point that C++ is not OOP

No, no, no, take this off the list. Discuss among yourselves, if you like,
but don’t talk about language features on this list.

Thanks,
-Sam Lantinga, Software Engineer, Blizzard Entertainment

Arrrrg.
Please, the SDL discussion list is not for OO vs procedural vs
is-c+±an-oo-language battles and discussions.
Sorry, but these philosophical debates are better held elsewhere.

i myself like C++ for new and delete instead of malloc and free (and i do
like structures and objects on occaision) but on the other hand prefer
*printf to cout/cin and the file io of C…fopen fread fwrite fclose etc.

That is why I code in a mixture of C, mostly for libraries, and C++,
mostly for applications. And, always use the C IO libraries. Do what
works for you.

	Bob PendletonOn Sun, 2002-10-27 at 17:11, Atrix Wolfe wrote:


±-----------------------------------+

Alexander Pipelka wrote:

Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

hey, i got you! :wink: at least it’s good to know, you’re are still around,
reading the MLs. :slight_smile:

best regards …
clemens

Alexander Pipelka wrote:

Maybe a better approach would be to help with existing projects ?

Reinventing the wheel may be fun but isn’t very productive.

What Alexander is hinting at is the fact that there is a nice SDL-based
GUI already. Take a look at ParaGUI:

 http://www.paragui.org/

Alexander is the creator/maintainer of ParaGUI, hence the modesty. :slight_smile:

-Roy