Why do people hate BMP files?

SDL Development
21

At least is what paintbrush says about .bmp :wink:
“Microsoft Bitmap Files ©”

PieroOn Thu, 2004-07-01 at 13:27, Pierre G.Richard wrote:

Piero B. Contezini <piero lsc.com.br> writes:

Because bitmap is copy right from microsoft Âź and we they dont like to
be illegal.

You may be wrong or right.
I think you are wrong

But if you are right, why you, honest citizen, make use of SDL?
SDL implements LoadBitmap, and is “illegal” since the beginning.

Shhhhht
 don’t tell Redmond.

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22

Pierre G. Richard wrote:

So, while BMP files fill a need, RLE-encoded ones do not, and they complicate

the main SDL library, which (and it would seem that this is a design issue, and
an intelligent decision) has only very limited support for images.

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Just use http://www.libsdl.org/projects/SDL_image/

From memory you should just beable to go and replace the SDL_LoadBMP
with IMG_Load then you don’t even have to worry about what format the
file is in, as SDL_Image will take care of that for you.

23

Yes thats why I always use tga, its not the most compressed image but
saves a lot of space and has good quality, with alpha channel and
everything I need for high quality graphics.On Thu, 2004-07-01 at 13:40, Varmint wrote:

Pierre G. Richard wrote:

Piero B. Contezini <piero lsc.com.br> writes:

Because bitmap is copy right from microsoft Âź and we they dont like to

be illegal.

You may be wrong or right.
I think you are wrong

But if you are right, why you, honest citizen, make use of SDL?
SDL implements LoadBitmap, and is “illegal” since the beginning.

Shhhhht
 don’t tell Redmond.

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SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

Keep in mind BMP’s are a waste of space
786486 Jul 1 09:36 kgb.bmp
291149 Jun 28 00:28 kgb.png

Same texture files just one is saved as a BMP and one is saved as a
PNG
 If your distrubuting software full of BMP’s such as a Game

You’ll waste alot of space on the end users system, which is certainly
not acceptable in our company and many others I know.

Thx
Varmint

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24

What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

	Bob Pendleton--

±-------------------------------------+

25

"What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

     Bob Pendleton"

Is this subject trivial if it mean have a 2GB games files or 500MB?
(THIS IS JUST A EXAMPLE). Yes we would have to ship on DVDs making the
cost go up the sells go down and profits go down.

How can you say this is a trivial thing. Even if you going to give
away what you make, it has to be downloaded. Do you thin people are
going to download HUGH files, if you have many textures in BMP format,
this will greatly increase the size. This subject is at the same
impotence in design as what program lang. to use!

So lets use the little amount of bandwidth text takes to send around,
and save it on the HUGH download BMP could/can/will make!

AndrewOn Thu, 01 Jul 2004 15:39:22 -0500, Bob Pendleton wrote:

What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

           Bob Pendleton

–
±-------------------------------------+

SDL mailing list
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http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

26

"What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

     Bob Pendleton"

Is this subject trivial if it mean have a 2GB games files or 500MB?
(THIS IS JUST A EXAMPLE). Yes we would have to ship on DVDs making the
cost go up the sells go down and profits go down.

So, in your opinion, using your strawman argument, you feel that using
BMP files is a bad idea. Good for you, you can see that 3 > 2.

OTOH, you think that since you feel that way then all people everywhere
should be forced to not use this bad bad thing called a BMP file. You
feel you have the right, and the need to force people to do things the
way you want them done.

You are making the same mistake that lead to the murder of the millions
of people by the Nazis, the destruction of the twin towers by Al Qaeda,
and the enslavement of Africans in the US and elsewhere. Are you proud?

Now shut up and crawl back into your hole.

		Bob PendletonOn Thu, 2004-07-01 at 15:56, Andrew Balmos wrote:

How can you say this is a trivial thing. Even if you going to give
away what you make, it has to be downloaded. Do you thin people are
going to download HUGH files, if you have many textures in BMP format,
this will greatly increase the size. This subject is at the same
impotence in design as what program lang. to use!

So lets use the little amount of bandwidth text takes to send around,
and save it on the HUGH download BMP could/can/will make!

Andrew

On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 15:39:22 -0500, Bob Pendleton <@Bob_Pendleton> wrote:

What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

           Bob Pendleton

–
±-------------------------------------+

SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

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27

“OTOH, you think that since you feel that way then all people everywhere
should be forced to not use this bad bad thing called a BMP file. You
feel you have the right, and the need to force people to do things the
way you want them done.”

No I don’t force people, I strongly disagree with, I never use and
never will. When I see it I do what I can to try to get it changed.
Where did I say I forced people to do. Look around, how many full
distos of anything use BMP’s? I DON’T NEED to force anyone to do
ANYTHING, to me is sounds like your FORCING ME to do go your way. I
forced you in no way, I pointed out that this subject IS NOT trivial
and gave examples why. I don’t care what in the hell you do.

“You are making the same mistake that lead to the murder of the millions
of people by the Nazis, the destruction of the twin towers by Al Qaeda,
and the enslavement of Africans in the US and elsewhere. Are you proud?”

I’M proud that I take no part in this. I’m proud that I stand up for
what I think. Like said above I DID NOT FORCE ANYTHING!

“Now shut up and crawl back into your hole.”

 Childish 
On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 16:09:28 -0500, Bob Pendleton wrote:

On Thu, 2004-07-01 at 15:56, Andrew Balmos wrote:

"What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

     Bob Pendleton"

Is this subject trivial if it mean have a 2GB games files or 500MB?
(THIS IS JUST A EXAMPLE). Yes we would have to ship on DVDs making the
cost go up the sells go down and profits go down.

So, in your opinion, using your strawman argument, you feel that using
BMP files is a bad idea. Good for you, you can see that 3 > 2.

OTOH, you think that since you feel that way then all people everywhere
should be forced to not use this bad bad thing called a BMP file. You
feel you have the right, and the need to force people to do things the
way you want them done.

You are making the same mistake that lead to the murder of the millions
of people by the Nazis, the destruction of the twin towers by Al Qaeda,
and the enslavement of Africans in the US and elsewhere. Are you proud?

Now shut up and crawl back into your hole.

                   Bob Pendleton

How can you say this is a trivial thing. Even if you going to give
away what you make, it has to be downloaded. Do you thin people are
going to download HUGH files, if you have many textures in BMP format,
this will greatly increase the size. This subject is at the same
impotence in design as what program lang. to use!

So lets use the little amount of bandwidth text takes to send around,
and save it on the HUGH download BMP could/can/will make!

Andrew

On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 15:39:22 -0500, Bob Pendleton wrote:

What a wonderful world we all live in, that so many people have so much
free time that they can devote to telling other people how to think!

What a sad world we live in, that so many people think they have the
right to tell other people how to think!

I have never seen a flame war over such a trivial thing


Please stop wasting time and bandwidth on this subject.

           Bob Pendleton

–
±-------------------------------------+

SDL mailing list
SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl

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SDL at libsdl.org
http://www.libsdl.org/mailman/listinfo/sdl
–
±-------------------------------------+

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28

Why are some people so “anti-bmp”? Is it because the
format is simply “old”? Is it because of “Microsoft”?
Geez. It is just a file format.

It doesn’t even have an official, precise specification; only a bunch of
reverse-engineered, mostly incomplete, guesswork “specs”. I don’t know
how many times I’ve saved a BMP in one app, tried to load it in another,
and had it not work.

The only benefit I’ve found is when saving screenshots: saving an uncompressed
BMP directly is faster than a PNG–even if PNG compression is disabled. I’m
not sure why; I need to profile the PNG library to find out. (However,
compressed PNGs often load faster than BMPs, since the smaller size and
corresponding reduction in disk access tends to outweigh the extra CPU use.)

On another note: I’ve been using “jasper” to do
jpeg2000 images. Jpeg2000s are much smaller than
regular jpegs and they look really nice. “jasper” is
a open source reference implementation.

I’m pretty sure the JPEG2000 code in Jasper is GPL-incompatible, at least,
and I think JPEG2000 is actively patent-encumbered. For these reasons, at
least, I doubt it’s suitable for SDL use.On Wed, Jun 30, 2004 at 12:30:48PM -0700, Dennis Jenkins wrote:

–
Glenn Maynard

29

Wow, I never thought I’d have to do this, especially on the SDL list, but


PLONKOn Thu, Jul 01, 2004 at 02:20:51PM -0700, Andrew Balmos wrote:


 Childish 

<126 lines of quote snipped>

-bill!

30

Not that I think it should be ripped from SDL, but I agree. I can’t edit
any of my Defendguin bitmaps (Defendguin was written way before SDL_image)
in Gimp for some reason, any more. shrug

-bill!On Thu, Jul 01, 2004 at 05:50:10PM -0400, Glenn Maynard wrote:

It doesn’t even have an official, precise specification; only a bunch of
reverse-engineered, mostly incomplete, guesswork “specs”. I don’t know
how many times I’ve saved a BMP in one app, tried to load it in another,
and had it not work.

31

Bill - This is somewhat what I have been trying to say with just more
added. I dont think SDL should have BMP removed, people still use it,
it there choice. What I said Is I wont use it and I SUGGEST that other
people don’t either, but in the end its there choice.

If you don’t BMP code in your SDL compile, than compile it with out
BMP support


AndrewOn Thu, 1 Jul 2004 14:53:01 -0700, Bill Kendrick wrote:

Wow, I never thought I’d have to do this, especially on the SDL list, but


PLONK

On Thu, Jul 01, 2004 at 02:20:51PM -0700, Andrew Balmos wrote:


 Childish 

<126 lines of quote snipped>

-bill!

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32

By Godwin’s Law, you lose Bob, and the thread is over.

JPOn Thursday 01 July 2004 02:09 pm, Bob Pendleton wrote:

You are making the same mistake that lead to the murder of the millions
of people by the Nazis,

33

You are making the same mistake that lead to the murder of the millions
of people by the Nazis,

By Godwin’s Law, you lose Bob, and the thread is over.

ROFLMAO

I’m well aware of Godwin’s law :slight_smile: I was hoping the rest of the crew
would react exactly the way you did and drop the subject.

Thank you for your good sense.

	Bob PendletonOn Thu, 2004-07-01 at 21:52, Jeff wrote:

On Thursday 01 July 2004 02:09 pm, Bob Pendleton wrote:

JP

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34

Hi

Well

For me it is just like linux distros thing. I love
Slackware and I talk about it with love.
My boss think that Fedora is the best.
My friend loves Debian


Wich one is the best?

It is a matter of “what is more suitable for me”.
I would implement a complex way of handling images
formats if it is really important for my app, but,
sometimes, you just need the basics
 so, why make
the things complex when it can be as easy as possible?
I do not like slackware because of the legends
 I
love slackware because it fullfilled all my
expectations about a OS.
As someone said, I do not remeber who, “look, you
have the source, you have the power” and that is it.
It is frustrating when I have to use something and I
can not because someone said I should not


See you.

J. In?cio.___________________________________________________________
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